HOST: You’re listening to Rights and Wrongs, from Human Rights Watch. I’m Ngofeen Mtutubwele. This week, what it’s like to be detained by ICE: U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
NGOFEEN: What do you want people to know about your experience in ICE detention?
HARPINDER: I don't think people are aware of what people go through inside. We were legally in the U.S.
HOST: In this episode, you’re going to hear from two people–someone detained on the inside, and from a lawyer on the outside. We recorded this interview in September 2025. The story takes place in Florida.
NGOFEEN: Okay, there we go. Um, how do I pronounce your name correctly, just for starters.
HARPINDER: I was gonna ask you the same thing. Mine's Harpinder.
NGOFEEN: Harpinder. Okay. Mine's Ngofeen
HARPINDER: Ngofeen.
HOST: In 2016 Harpinder, his wife and their two children immigrated from the U.K. to the U.S. They entered on an E-2 investor visa. They bought a business, a barbecue franchise, that also did catering…
HARPINDER: We were really good at catering, I have to say, as a family. You know, we were rockstar status with easy cater. 4.9 out of five over thousands of caterings. You know, we, we did really good - we took a personal interest in it, and, um, as all business owners do, there's nothing special there. But, you know, we went that extra bit.
Host: But Covid hit, and they fell behind on their state taxes. Harpinder met with tax authorities and worked out a payment plan. By 2025 he was on an EB-5 visa, which allows for permanent residency - green card. But his tax problems complicated things, and he had to meet regularly with an immigration officer. At first he did those meetings in person. Then the probation officer was giving the vibe of, ‘I see you’re paying, don’t worry about it, you don’t have to come in, you can do it remotely’. And then he gets a phone call from the officer. Hey, we actually need you to come in. So, on this particular day, February 11th, 2025, he comes in in person…
Harpinder: I mean, I remember feeling I was… You know the family was just recover from the flu and I was kind of a little bit under the weather.
So normally his office is, as you go through the main door, it's on the right hand side. And then today he said to me, ‘we're gonna go this way.’
‘Okay, we're going this way’. And next thing you know, I saw these two guys, and, uh, he’s already got the handcuffs out. Hey, we're from ICE. You've overstayed. You've overstayed since 2018. And he, and he slapped the cuffs on me.
And I'm going, ‘we haven't overstayed you've made a mistake. Here we are, we're in status’.
NGOFEEN: I've never been hand cuffed. Um, but like, what does that feel like?
HARPINDER: It's horrible. It's absolutely, you know, you just feel this sense that you're falling, that there's nothing to catch you. Now there's like, there's no, um, you know, they're not listening anymore and you are not you anymore.
[The sound of a car driving on the interstate]]
HOST: The ICE officers put Harpinder in a van and start driving. While he’s in the car, his mind is spinning. Thinking of all the logistical things he’s supposed to get done. There’s that catering gig he’s supposed to show up for today - how will the rest of the family take care of that. Then there’s the tax bill obviously hanging over the whole family, over him -- legally dealt with, payment plan that he’s following and all -- but still a huge responsibility. … And then, there’s his kids…
[sound of phone vibrating]
His son starts calling.
HARPINDER: So he, he kind of, he kind of sensed something was up that I've been there too long. And then when he started to freak out was when we were driving down the 408 into Central Orlando and he, and he's calling, he's calling and calling and calling and like they, they just kept hanging up the phone and I said to them, I said, ‘You know, if you just tell him what's happened to me, he can start contacting lawyers and, and he'll stop calling you. But at the moment he's gonna carry on until he gets an answer’. It’s just, any son would, especially my one. He, he's, he's, he's, he's crazy. Not, you know, crazy, crazy. But he is, he is lovable, crazy.
HOST: He arrives at some place he doesn’t know. And, once there…
HARPINDER: We're waiting. And they put me in a cell with, with other people. And some of those people were frantic, crying, some were like laughing, and some of the people were in tears. You know, one had left his son who was like four or five years old. He is really close to his son.
NGOFEEN: So you are already handcuffed at your wrists…
HAPRINDER: Yep.
NGOFEEN: ... and then someone comes, tells you, ‘stand up’ or you stay seated?
HARPINDER: No, they, they, they get you out of the cells and, and, and they take everyone out in a and they line up, um, and they bring these boxes out with these chains and cuffs in them. Heavy boxes. And as they're pulling one out after the other, it makes that little rasping sound or the chains tangled up. The way those chains rasp and the way they, the way they behave when they, when they're shackling you up.
You just feel so, I mean, I, I used to hear that chain and it used to just get to me, it used to like, you know, get me to a point where I'm never gonna come out of this. I, you know, I couldn't, you know, it's really hard to express. Just that noise. It's unbelievable, you know?
They shackle your ankles, so one leg at a time and they, they kind of like nudge you in the back. They don't even verbalize - make you lift your leg up, you know, like you would do like, like a horseshoe thing. They put one cuff on you and then that's got a chain on it onto the next leg. Then they would do one around your waist, make you turn around, um, and then they'd uncuff you from the front.
NGOFEEN: Like a belt almost? Same chain, like…
HAPRINDER: Yeah. Yeah. So, and then that was it. And then they chucked us on a bus. Um, you know, you can't even make the step up to the bus with the, with the chains around your ankles and, you know, you just shuffling along trying to find a seat, and it's just this bus of desperation, you know, like just people that just lost all hope.
HOST: Seven, eight hour bus ride.
NGOFEEN: What to you is like an example of a day in detention that sort of like typifies what you experienced there?
HARPINDER: So if, if you'd allow me, there's three different types of experience, um, that I
NGOFEEN: Please.
HARPINDER: So the first one was when we were in processing. So after waiting outside that facility for three hours in the bus. We were brought in, um, and we were put in a room, uh, which is just pure concrete.
Um, there's like a little ridge that people could sit on, but it's all concrete.
And there's, uh, an open toilet at the back. Um, and it says on there maximum capacity: 25. And we were at that time, 42 of us. And then a few hours later, we were about 50 or so in that one room. And that stayed for four days like that. So you're trying to find somewhere to sit, trying to find somewhere to lie down.
And people were taking turns, you know, people sleeping around where people were doing, you know, toilet and things.
NGOFEEN: How big, like the room, like how would you describe it?
HAPRINDER: Smaller than like, you know, like a master bedroom, smaller than a master bedroom. like literally if, if we had everyone sitting down, everyone else was standing up. So you could probably have about 20, 22 people sitting down and everyone else that was lying out on the floor.
Um, so, you know, you were kind of head one way, head the other way, head one way, head the other way when, when we were trying to lie down to get some kind of sleep. I was using my shoes for a pillow.
One toilet, um, no water. They said there's water in the tap on the toilet, but, who's gonna, you know, and like, you know, we were asking for fresh water. It just depended on the guard.
And, you know, you'd get fed, um, just tiny portions. Um, no medication. I had no medication. They even, I didn't, even, when they brought me into that facility, they took my asthma inhaler from me as well. So I had no, no, you know, I take insulin, I, you know, all this kind of stuff and heart meds and pancreas meds, and none of those were made available for me and I had no idea of, you know, what time or day it was.
So disorientated. And every two hours they'd come in and do a count, you know, like it's, we're not spawning in here. We're not, you know, there, there's no, it's, it's concrete everywhere. You've got the keys to the door, you put us in here, why do you need to count us every two hours?
NGOFEEN: And so you're eating in the, in the cell, not like out in like a cafeteria type …
HARPINDER: Yeah. In the cell. Most of the time it was in polystyrene, um, containers.
HOST: That’s those white take-out containers…
Harpinder: And we're still in shackles and like they didn't unshackle you from the waist or anything, so you, you're having to kind of stooped down and eat like a dog out of a bowl, um, out this polystar container. So you kind of like, just all, you know, hunkered up together and you're eating like a bowl. Some people bent over as much as they can and try to, you know. It's like we're not human anymore.
HOST: From the processing center, which was called Krome, in Miami, they move to the next, second type of facility.
HARPINDER: They call it the camp. So you come outta processing and they put you in a camp, a big warehouse designed for 48, uh, detainees. There was like a hundred of us in there. So temporary beds were put out and, you know, you share four showers, four toilets, between a hundred people.
You couldn't get sunlight. You know, there, there were, we were all quarantined. People were suffering everywhere. Three people, actually, one person died of tuberculosis from our unit, and two were isolated. We had no hand wash. We had no, you know, hand sanitizer. Um, you know, you couldn't take, um, you couldn't go to the toilet in privacy. Someone sitting right next to you, um, showering open in front of everyone.
The guards are - they don't, they don't care about you. They don't care. And from what I gather, those guys were getting paid 50 bucks an hour. Uh, one of them was bragging that he was making $16,000 that month. And it's like on the heads of us, you know, and, and it, you know, by treading on us. And it's just, you know, if I, if I was earning that kind of money in a job, I'd be smiling all day at work. I really would. But they, they just treated us even worse.
HOST: Let’s take a moment and talk about the treatment of the guards.
Harpinder: I remember there, there was two officers in particular, I dunno if I can mention them by name, um, but they would come in at five in the morning, um, for a six o'clock shift just because they enjoyed riling everyone up banging on the doors, shouting, screaming.
NGOFEEN: What do you mean when you say they're, they're banging on walls and yelling?
HARPINDER: No, they, they, they would, they would kick doors. They would, they would go by, you know, hit the doors with whatever they had. Um, like, you know, just screaming at five o'clock in the morning. Um…
NGOFEEN: What are they screaming?
HARPINDER: just, you know, like, uh, ‘wah’. You know, like that. ‘Come on’. And it's just like, like I, I dunno what they got out of it. I just don't get it. Um, you know, ‘woo-hoo’.
And then they, they picked on, um, two guys, two black guys in particular. Um, one just, one guy, like sweetest guy. He is from Uganda. Kakanyero. They, they, they picked on him like you wouldn't believe. Particularly with Kakanyero, they would be like, ‘Hey, fat boy, fat boy.’ You know, like just shouting at him, top of their voices. Then it, then that went to kaka boy, and, you know, and, and that means poop in, in, in Latin language.
And, and he's saying, look, you know, I, you guys might not, whatever, but he goes, I come from Uganda. I come from a strong lineage of, you know, and man, I'm proud of my name, man, and don't, don't ridicule my name. You know, I'm, I'm here not as a prisoner. I'm not here as a, we're detainees. We, we are not being here for punishment.
We are here until you guys process us and they just wouldn't stop on him. They really wouldn't.
To the point where, you know, Kakanyero went on suicide watch after they, they kept on harassing him.
Um, and, and, you know, this is, this isn't a job, that's not part of your job to put people down and, then one day like this, this guy that's just so, such a stone wall of ignorance and hate, uh, comes up to me one day and says that, ‘Hey, so you are the barbecue guy’. I'm like, ‘dude, what, what is this? You know, what do you want from me? Leave me alone. I'm, I'm the barbecue guy? I'm the guy that also asked you to open the door so I could take a breath of oxygen’. But in, in, in the, so, you know, I, I, when, when he said that to me about the restaurant thing, I said, ‘dude, me and you are not gonna connect. I'm not having any kind of conversation with you. You are what you are and, and you are gonna be that.
I'll be out of here one day. I'll be, whether it's here or whether it's back in the uk, I'll be alive. I'll be with my family at one point and, and we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll come back from this, but you are gonna be here for the rest of your life’. I said to him, and I said, ‘that's all you're worthy of. Don't talk to me, just leave me alone.’
HOST: Third type of facility: Federal.
HARPINDER: The worst, the worst experience of all was in the federal prison in Miami. That was just, it takes everything and it destroys you. There was a group of us that had been together since February and when we walked into that federal prison that night, soon as we walked in and we're going deeper and deeper into the prison and then they opened the, the, that floor up. And this, you know, it's typical, it's just like a movie scene where people are like banging on the doors, looking at you through the little glass on their cells. Um, and I just remember looking at my friend Marlon, and I was thinking, we are in big trouble here. This is not. None of this was [00:21:30] for us, but this is, this is a level that we, I don't think I'm gonna be able to handle this. This is like, wow.
And then, you know, a lot, some of us were lucky enough to get bunked together, but I had to go bunk with a person that I'd never seen before who did have an edge to him and… to, to be in it and, and to just, you know, that utter despair every night when they, to lock that door knowing that you just can't go out. We had a little tiny slit window that looked out over the Southern, um, cityscape of Miami, which is quite beautiful.
Um, but, you know, I remember sleeping the other way. I just didn't wanna look at it. I, you know, I thought ‘America's kind of turned, its back on me. I don't wanna look at it. I don't wanna look how beautiful it is. I don't wanna’. It was just burning me, you know? And I, I, and I remember one conversation we had with my friend, the Cuban guy who we were bunking with, and he said, you know, he said, ‘this is America, Harry, we're gonna be fine’.
And after a while I said, you know, what America is this toilet that's not working. That's America. Outside's not for me or us. We're in here because that isn't for us. This is our reality: toilet that doesn't work. We've got a guard screaming in your face telling you, I just don't give a f.
We had no AC for the last two weeks in that cell. Um, you know, banging on the door, just asking for, just let me, you know, I, I'd lie down and try and gasp air through the bottom of the door, just 'cause the outside had AC but we, you know, we didn't have any in our cell. Just desperate acts like that and then when, when you, when you relay that to another human being, whose safekeeping is in their hands, whether they, whether they like it or not, whether they, that's their, in their job description that they want to be a part of or not. The true facts are that if something happens to me, it's their responsibility, but they just don't care.
You know, when I talk about the guards, 99% of them were, the way I describe them. There were some nuggets. There were some good people in there, very few. But there were,. Mr. Wilson, I remember from Krome. I said to him, look, is there any chance I can get, you know, my inhaler? Because, uh, and he says, you shouldn't be without your inhaler. And I could see he was visually upset by, you know, the, you know, the way we were being treated. And he took me to, you know, see if we could go and find it.
And so like there was just bin after bin after bin of these, you know, anonymous brown envelopes full of people's, you know, valuables, you know, mementos, money, you know, all this kind of stuff. But no, no process. There's no, there's no order to anything. Everything's just haphazard and random. And I just saw this one thing that had a trail of towns that this bin had gone through.
And I thought, it's gotta be this one dug around in there and I found my inhaler and I put it in my pocket and, and you know, that first breath of beautiful air, you know.
HOST: Harpinder was deported … back to the UK. He hasn’t seen his family since. When we come back, the outside, from an attorney.
AD BREAK.
HOST: Now that we’ve heard what Harpinder’s detention was like on the inside, let's talk to a lawyer on the outside to make sense of all this. This is woman from my home state of Tenneesee, a straight talker who basically summarized how this whole system works.
KATIE: My name is Katie Blankenship. I am an immigration attorney and I am the director of Sanctuary of the South.
We have clients in detention centers throughout the country, as well as a large number of non detained clients.
Alright, there are three ways that ICE can have a detention center, three ways ICE can run it. They're on site. It's ICE agents all day, but they do contract out to private prison. They fully contract out with a private prison group.
Or three they enter into, and this is like a whole alphabet soup, what's called an IGSA and Intergovernmental services agreement with a small municipality. Think Baker County, Florida.
You I, everybody listening to this podcast, who pays their taxes, it costs us upwards of $200 a day per person in ICE detention.
Where does that money go? That money goes to the private prison companies. Most of the time ICE opens these centers that are in contract with the local municipalities in very remote places of the country. Now, the remoteness of these facilities is very intentional.
There's very little legal services in these areas. There's very little access to any sort of resources or immigrants rights, protection, or know your rights, which are any of the things that you would get where there's a larger municipality or even contact to legal services. When you are in ice detention, you are not provided the same rights as you are if you're in criminal detention. So they can pick me up, they can take me to any detention in the country. They don't have to tell me where I'm going. They don't have to tell me where I am when I get there. They don't have to tell me how to contact legal services. I have had families come through and literally be separated intentionally, sent to the most remote different parts of the country just to be cruel. Just to separate people and have them in as remote place as possible.
What also happens, and that's critical, is that in these smaller communities, they are poor communities, right? A tiny, tiny little place does not have a lot of money.
NGOFEEN: The, the, you're talking about like the remote communities…
KATIE: The rural communities. So let's talk about like Baker County, Florida's a perfect example. Baker County is in a little town called McClinney, Florida.
There's hardly anything there except for a courthouse that has the mural of the KKK.
McClenney, Florida's a tiny town in north Florida. There is nothing around there except Jacksonville's about an hour away. Tallahassee's about an hour and a half away.
There is not a single immigration lawyer in a 60 mile radius. None. Doesn't exist. Baker County, because it is such a small town, because it has such a small budget on its own, courted ICE, created this facility and propped up their entire county budget on the ice detention center. And this happens in the, and this is the same thing that's happened in Stewart Georgia, in Glades County, Florida, throughout Louisiana, like this is, this happens over and over again.
So this county is now completely reliant on these funds, right? They have now created a budget that is completely reliant upon these funds. And what is their impetus when considering what provisions to provide, how to run this facility, and then consider what happens when they make those decisions and have no immigration training, have no understanding of the immigration system, do not understand the difference between civil and punitive detention.
Right, they don't know any of that, but they do know that if they don't have that money, the county collapses. Even with the ICE money, they're hardly making through. We would see, you know, city commissioner meetings from Glades County, Baker County over and over again. You'd see they weren't even in the black when they were getting the ICE money.
So what are they gonna do? They're gonna provide as ittle as possible. They're gonna give the worst medical care, they're gonna give the cheapest, they're going to, they're gonna be understaffed. It's over and over and over again. So if you couple the idea that it is more profitable to be cruel with an an anti-immigrant animus, that has been so profusely and disgustingly successful, that has mostly come from the right wing Republican party, but every, every political leader in this country is guilty of it. Obama deported the most people under. You know, there is, every one of our leaders has disappointed us on this issue. And to not understand that we are destroying lives and frankly, destroying the fabric of this country for money and profit and power at the expense of human beings.
NGOFEEN: So, um, in theory, assume ICE detains someone legally, what would be the legal way to treat them? like what are the standards and where, like where do those standards come from?
KATIE: Well, they start and they really start and end with the United States Constitution. So immigrants on anybody on American soil has constitutional rights. End of story. That's not debatable. There's been a lot of stuff in the news under this administration. They don't have due process. They don't have anything. BS, no completely, completely false, flag on the field.
So they have different. Right. Their, their rights are differently considered, right? There are some rights that yes, American citizens have that immigrants might not have, but basic Bill of Rights: right to due process, right to free speech, right, to be free of cruel and unusual punishment. All applies, a hundred percent.
So this is where our, this is where the law really stops and starts for the standards available to immigrants and detention. They also have a right to counsel. There's a big difference, right? If I'm arrested for a DUI, I have a right to a counsel that the government pays for. If ICE comes to my door and takes me into detention, I have a right to an attorney that I pay for.
That's the biggest difference. There's no free counsel, but a person in detention has a right to call their lawyer, they have a right to confidential conversations. Those rights can be violated and federal lawsuits can be filed.
We have, we have one right now ongoing. Besides that, the National Detention Standards set out specific, just, they're exactly what they say in the name. They are the standards by which people are supposed to be de detained. when in ice custody. And those detention standards are violated all day every day.
The national detention standards set forth all sorts of critical things like what happens if somebody has a serious mental health issue? What happens if somebody has suicidal ideation? What happens if the guards use force? They're supposed to be reports about, they're supposed to actually get permission. It's supposed to be reviewed. There's supposed to be documents in the file. I can't tell you the last time I've seen something like that in somebody's file.
Right, there are specific criteria set forth also in the national de detention standards of medical emergencies. You know, I have a client, Maksym Chernyak, who died at Krome. After being there for two weeks, less than two weeks, begging for medical attention, and they failed to do anything they're supposed to do by their own standards and just frankly, their oaths of do no harm.
You know, we've, we're filing a federal lawsuit for wrongful death on his behalf because he would be alive today if not for ICE. We firmly believe that. So there are frameworks in place, but when we are operating in a lawless system, what good are these laws?
HOST: Katie says that her client of Katie’s was a Ukrainian refugee who entered the country in 2024 and was granted humanitarian parole. After having seizures and not receiving medical care for about four hours, he was found braindead. He was 44 years old.
Katie: There is a feeling right now, It is almost impossible, impossible to win. At all. To get any sort of relief. Asylum cases are being denied at a rate I haven't seen before, on cases I would typically win, mostly because judges are too scared not to go with the Trump playbook because he just fired 125 of them.
There is no more bond. Bond is basically over.
NGOFEEN: Tell us what bond is.
I think this foray into the weeds is really important because, but like everything with this situation, it is in the weeds that the humanity gets choked out
KATIE: Well, typically for the entire time there's been ice detention centers, there are two ways that people typically get out while their case is pending.
Alright. One is bond and one is parole bond. It's very simple. Bond is an immigration court, only an immigration judge can grant bond.
Parole is ICE only ICE can grant parole.
Bond is over. Um, forever. I mean,
for years a ton of people have been eligible for bond. A bond is a serious thing. I have to file a bond motion. I have to put forth proof of this person's value to the community.
Show that they are not a risk of flight. They have no history of violence. Show why they're important to their community, present multiple levels of support from their community, a sponsor in the community. Money so that they can be tracked way. I mean, it's like, this is not a simple thing. The judge has done a, a considerate like evaluation of a case. Bond is over.
And then to double the pain, the Trump administration in DC has sent clear instructions to ICE that there basically is no more parole. They have said in memos it will no longer, uh, it must now be done on a case by case basis.
'Cause typically there's just sort, there's all sorts of people that, sure, you're gonna process them for their case, they're gonna show up, but there's no need to keep 'em in detention.
HOST: So what does that legalese mean practically?
So every humanitarian parole request I submit. I've done for people with stage four kidney failure, we've submitted parole requests for pregnant women, we have submitted parole requests for mothers who, just, uh, recently had, gave birth.
I mean, it is … there's just no words for it.
NGOFEEN: What should people know? Like, and I really do mean like these are conversations that I am having. I'm sure you are having, but I'm actually having with, I had like, I've had three conversations this week with friends where we're like, okay, if something happens to somebody, what should we do? Do we like go out there and be like, ‘you can't do this because X, Y, Z.’
Do we need to like have a rights card? Like what are some of the types of things that. People can do if they're in the state where they can, you know,
KATIE: Okay, so let's take it in a couple phases. Let's say you're at, um,you are witnessing an ICE raid or an ICE action. You should maintain a safe distance, but record and narrate. Record and narrate. Record and narrate. If the officers approach you and say, are you recording? You say, yes, it's my right to do so.
If they tell you that it's illegal or not to do that, you should stop. 'cause you, you will get arrested and they will destroy the footage you've gotten most likely. So try your best. To, um, adhere to the instructions of the law enforcement officers, but while documenting as much as you can, and then you need a plan for getting that out there, having local contacts in the press is a great idea.
Most every co, most every community in the country has some sort of immigration coalition going on right now. You should find them.
but you're gonna wanna document and yes, know your rights cards actually is a brilliant idea. There's a huge amount of false information that goes out to our immigrant communities, and the biggest thing to take away is if ICE doesn't have a judicial warrant.
Goodbye. It is [00:39:30] illegal Judicial warrant or no. Or it, no, they can't come into your house. They can't do any of that.
And um, also just Google this judicial warrant versus ICE warrant. It will give you an image, it will show you, there'll be multiple resources on this. Print them out. Right. If you are, if you or your loved ones are at risk of ICE, print these out and have a copy that you can see it, your children can see it.
Your friends and family can see it. So [00:40:00] you know the difference. Because if ICE knocks on your door and they have an ICE warrant and not a signed and dated judicial warrant, they don't come in. They don't have to. You do not have to let them in.
Here’s what i would quite literally do. I would say and do nothing. I would not open the door. I would not talk to them. I would draw my shades. I would not say anything. I don’t care what they yelled at my door. I’m not gonna answer, I’m not gonna give them any reason to think I’m home.
If for some reason you make any sort of verbal contact with them, you should ask them to show them your judicial, show you their judicial warrant, not in person. They have to slide it under the door. They have to walk up to your window and hold it up to you, and you're looking for three things. You're looking for the [00:40:30] judge's signature, that it's properly dated and it clearly identifies you and your home.
That they're actually in the right place with the right person doing, and those warrants will often be limited in scope. So you wanna read it, you this is, this is your, these are your rights a hundred percent. To fully understand this, if they only present an ICE warrant or a judicial warrant that's not signed, goodbye.
You don't say anything else. You say, I know my rights. I'm not opening. Close the blinds, turn the lights out [00:41:00] and wait for them to leave. Um, and ideally you have legal counsel that you can call and say, here's what's happening.
HOST: One last practical thought from Katie.
If you are truly invested in helping your immigrant communities, then you need to invest in your community. So there should be some sort of plan within community groups that are supporting each other.
Let's say [00:41:30] there's an ICE raid at the Home Depot down the street in your town. There should be a phone. That people are calling. There should be some sort of alert system that's going out to folks and there should be some sort of emergency plan for when folks get detained that there is help to get them legal counsel at least immediately just to triage and even 'cause the minute you have a lawyer, even in this completely effed up system, the difference of a lawyer is huge, right?
It's a huge deal. They know that somebody's eyes are on this person. They cannot just be disappeared. So have a have. Go ahead and identify your legal resources. Know who to call. Have contacts for the family to call.
If I was doing deep community planning right now, I'd be talking about, okay, there's a raid in our town. Where is the safe place people can go? We've identified the Rotary Club, the church and the school. There are private signs in each of these rooms where people can go. That's what's gonna happen for the [00:42:30] people who are detained.
We are getting in touch with their families. We're making sure the children can get to school safely and we're getting them in touch with legal counsel. Katie Blankenship, thank you so much for your time.
It's been so good to be with you. Thank you so much.
Human Rights Watch has a report on the U.S. Detention called “You Feel Like Your Life is Over: Abusive Practices at Three Florida Immigration Detention Centers Since January 2025.” Katie Blankenship contributed to that report, and it includes Harpinder Chauhan’s story, and many others. To learn more you, go to HRW.org and look for ______________. If you’re looking for a list of community resources, Katie Blankenship, who I spoke to, suggests everyone check the ACLU.org and ______ to find local community immigrant alliances.
This episode was produced by me and Curtis Fox. Sophie Soloway is the associate producer. Anthony Gale is the executive producer.
I’m Ngofeen Mputubwele. We’ll be back in two weeks with a new episode. Thanks for listening!
